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CarbonPoker · Full Tilt · Cake Poker · PokerStars · Ultimate Bet · Players Only · Bodog
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I've been approached several times about how to manage a bankroll, and when to cash out. I'm going to address this question very heavily in this post.
The following guidelines will assure with a high confidence level that you never go broke if you are +ROI in the games you are playing, and you exercise good game selection.
Proper Bankroll Management Minimums:
$65 - $1.10 STTs
$90 - $1.10 18-man
$130 - $1.10 45-man, $2.20 STTs
$210 - $5.25 HU
$215 - $3.30 STTs
$270 - $6.25 HU
$357 - $5.50 STTs
$416 - $3.25 45-man
$420 - $10.50 HU
$422 - $6.50 STTs
$440 - $2.20 MTTs, $2.20 180-man
$495 - $3.30 90-man
$585 - $6.50 18-man
$715 - $11 STTs
$780 - $12 STTs
$820 - $21 HU
$832 - $6.50 45-man
$880 - $4.40 MTT, $4.40 180-man
$990 - $11 18-man
$1040 - $16 STTs
$1080 - $12 18-man
$1100 - $5.50 MTTs
$1300 - $6.50 MTTs, $12 27-man, $20 STTs
$1430 - $22 STTs
$1440 - $16 18-man
$1530 - $12 45-man
$1560 - $24 STTs
$1650 - $11 90-man
$1755 - $27 STTs
$1760 - $8.80 MTTs
$1980 - $22 18-man
$2100 - $52.50 HU
$2145 - $33 STTs
$2160 - $24 18-man
$2340 - $36 SNGs
$2400 - $11 MTTs
$2430 - $27 18-man
$2470 - $38 STTs
$2600 - $12 MTTs, $12 180-man
$2970 - $33 18-man
$3300 - $16.50 MTTs
$3320 - $26 45-man
$3420 - $38 18-man
$3450 - $27 45-man
$3570 - $55 STTs
$3900 - $60 STTs, $26 90-man
$4200 - $22 MTTs, $22 180-man
$4250 - $105 HU
$4860 - $38 45-man
$4875 - $75 STTs
$4950 - $55 18-man
$5400 - $60 18-man, $27 MTTs
$6600 - $33 MTTs
$7660 - $60 45-man
$7800 - $39 MTTs
$8250 - $55 90-man
$8500 - $210 HU
$11000 - $55 MTTs
$12000 - $60 MTTs
$15000 - $75 MTTs
$20800 - $109 MTTs
$43000 - $215 MTTs
$106000-$530 MTTs
Clarifications:
- For Double or Nothing SNGs, use the HU guidelines.
- For MTTs with less than 150 players, use the 90-man guidelines.
- If your favorite game is not found on here, simply multiply the buyin by 40 for HU, 50 for FTP's Matrix SNGs, 65 for STTs, 90 for 18-20 man, 108 for 27-man, 128 for 45-man, 150 for 90-man, or 200 for 180-man or MTTs and add it to the list!
- For satellites, to determine how many buyins you need, use the formula (2000/x), where x is the % of the field that gets paid. For example, if a satellite tournament pays 20% of the field, then (2000/20) = 100, so you need 100 buyins.
- I will be crossposting this on my blog here so if you ever want to reference this, that's the easiest place to find it!
- These buyin recommendations are very conservative and are intended to ensure that you make consistant money while your risk of ruin is extremely minimal. It is made for professional players who cannot afford to replenish their bankroll. Recreational players may feel free to cut these recommendations in half.
- Satellites for must-play tournaments should only be played if you have enough in your bankroll for the target tournament, and you have an edge in that target event. There is an exception to this rule, below.
- I didn't include any game with higher than a 10% rake, because I feel that those games are ripoffs.
- If you are feeling good, don't play too far away from your highest allowable game. For instance, if your bankroll allows you to play $22 SNGs and you are playing $11 SNGs, you are not allowing yourself to make enough money.
- If things have been rough lately, or you have lost confidence, there's no need to play at your highest allowable level. Get back that winning feeling by dropping down, and scoring some wins. You'll still be working towards moving up.
Cashout strategy:
Pay yourself according to volume, not results.
Remove the following from your bankroll every time you play these games:
HU: 2% of your buyin
STTs: 3% of your buyin
18-man: 4% of your buyin
45-man: 5% of your buyin
90-man: 6% of your buyin
180-man/MTT: 8% of your buyin
Also remove all Rakeback/Bonuses earned
When your total cashouts reach the site's minimum cashout requirements, then cash out as soon as you can.
Clarifications:
- If you are a high buyin player, you may be playing a SNG where you are only expected to attain a very small ROI. In that case, divide your expected long-term ROI by 2 and cash out that much per game. For instance, if you are a $320 STT player who expects to make 2% ROI, cash out 1% ($3.30) per game played. That sounds small, but most of your income is coming from rakeback/bonuses anyway.
- For hyper/superturbo SNGs, only remove 1.5% per game.
Taking shots (optional):
Then allow yourself 1/4 of your cashout money for entertainment. Your shot can be your entertainment. For instance, if you are a $5 player who would like to take a shot at a $50 game, then save up $200 in cashouts, and then withdraw $150. use the other $50 for your game. Obviously this is not optimal, but some people will explode their bankrolls at some point if they never get a chance to chase their dreams!
Just one rule:
- If you take a shot and win, cash out at least 75% of your winnings RIGHT AWAY. Don't try to use the shot to pad your bankroll. The bankroll management plan is already designed to keep you where you are going to make the most money per hour.
When used together, over time, the Bankroll Management and Cashout Strategy will:
- Keep you playing at or near your optimal level. You won't have to decide what games to play. The system will do it for you.
- Ensure that you are beating the games at a high enough ROI to continue to play them. For instance if you maintain a 3% ROI at the $27 18-mans, although you are winning, you will be cashing out too much money (4%) to stay at that level, and the system will drop you back to the $16 level, where you will make more money per game.
- Keep you from facing high % fluctuations in your bankroll so your mindset is good.
- Have you making frequent cashouts no matter what your results are. This stops the endless cycle that some people have of moving up and moving down, but never cashing out!
- Allow you to plan. Your income will be easily predicatable. For instance, if you are going to play 100 $27 18-mans today, you know you will cash out exactly $108, no matter how you do.
- Encourage you to increase your volume.
- Give you the opportunity to take an occasional shot at a bigger event and chase your dreams.
I really hope this helps someone.
Jen
*edit - Please give your feedback. If you have any suggestions on how I can make this better, please let me know. My goal is to edit this to perfection, and update this to include whatever new popular games may come up.
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Rycky,
Any possibility you could post that spreadsheet you made? I have one of my own, but not sure exactly how to incorporate Jen's post here into it. That would be wicked awesome to have a spreadsheet of this Jennifear gold :)
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Thanks for the response Rycky.....I like the 75% idea.
Jennifear, please add to Rycky's reply to my post if necessary....thanks.
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 MattieBoy131: | |
Rycky,
Any possibility you could post that spreadsheet you made? I have one of my own, but not sure exactly how to incorporate Jen's post here into it. That would be wicked awesome to have a spreadsheet of this Jennifear gold :)
Hmm, its not anything flashy but if I can figure out a way to post it
I will. At worst it might give a spreadsheet genius or two a place to
start in making a better one. I'm at work at the moment so I'll see what I can do tonight.
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I'm confused about something
$270 - $6.25 HU
$357 - $5.50 STTs
With HU being higher variance than STTs shouldn't it be the other way around?
Also once the bankroll reaches $357 I can play anything thats listed at the smaller amounts right?
I also need clarification about the cashing out.If you play a $6.25 HU that is 12 cents to add to the cashing out that I understand.So until you reach the sites minimum cashout that 12 cents is gone and you can't play with it at all correct?
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WOW, this is the best piece of advice i've ever read!!!! I am grinding the single table and the 45 man tournaments.
thanks for sharing with us
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| MaestroJay: | |
I also need clarification about the cashing out.If you play a $6.25 HU that is 12 cents to add to the cashing out that I understand.So until you reach the sites minimum cashout that 12 cents is gone and you can't play with it at all correct?
I can answer this part, I do not count anything I've put aside as my cashout as part of my bankroll anymore. So if I have $1125 online, but I have $25 aside waiting for my next cashout, my "current bankroll" is $1100. I have zero experience with HU games so Jen will have to answer that one. | MaestroJay: | |
Also once the bankroll reaches $357 I can play anything thats listed at the smaller amounts right?
Yeah, you can play anything under that level, but I'm sure Jen will suggest you play the highest game you are rolled for as long as you can consistantly beat that game. Still, there aren't any restrictions for playing a smaller game for whatever reasons.
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| andressoprano: | |
If I didn't know Jen, I'd have my doubts whether she really exists or not, but I have talked to her enough to discard the idea of her been a bot.
She just seems too good to be truth.
She's good, but she's true enough for me. I've seen her make way too many plays to be a bot, thats for sure.
BTW Andres, great scores lately. Jen told me about them and told me you were a sicko... as always she knows her stuff. Keep it up.
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| pikappraider78: | |
does the 200 multiplyer refer to average buy in or max buy in? when i was on my own i was using foxes protected BR and was playing MTTs with an avg buy in of about 200 with a roll of 25-50k depending on swongs? is that underrolled?
I'm using Max Buyin. One problem with using ABI as an indicator, especially at the higher levels, is that there is a lot of fluctuation. To use an extreme example, it would be easy to risk ruin playing some 100s, some 200s and some 1000s, even if your ABI is 200, just because of the severe discrepency.
The answer to your second question is that, in general 25k-50k is plenty for ABI $200 MTTs, but not so if there is a severe discrepency and you play a LOT of 500+.
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jen, i dont know if this has been posted yet but how would you adjust this for rebuy tourneys?
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Jen, as a cash game player, I was wondering if there is any sort of similar based chart for those games?
It seems as though your chart revolves more about volume and paying yourself for that rather than how well your running, etc... basically making it more about playing well and not being results oriented.
something like that would help me a ton for cash games because im always basing my results on how much im +/-
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| Tito Francoma: | |
Jennifear,
So what if you are properly rolled based on your guidelines for STTs much higher than the stakes you currently play? I think I've been a bit of a bankroll nit but I've also been trying to build up somewhat of a volume before moving up in limits. I guess trying to prove to myself that I should move up. Are you suggesting that I just jump up to whatever stakes applicable based on your guidelines and run from there?
P.S. Thanks for this contribution, outstanding post.
General answer: If you built your roll the hard way, by grinding the SNGs that you are playing now, then a move up would be applicable. If you just had one huge luckbox score in a MTT and that's why you are overrolled, then it may be in your best interest to prove to yourself that you are beating your current level in order to move up.
Personal answer: While there's never anything severely wrong with playing overrolled if you are comfortable....after taking the liberty of looking at your stats, yes, you should move up if your goal is to maximize your hourly rate. You are absolutely destroying your current stakes and would most certainly make more per hour one level higher.
Whenever you are unsure about moving up, one suggestion is to tread softly by moving up when the games are softest, on the weekends.
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| poisoneye1986: | |
jen, i dont know if this has been posted yet but how would you adjust this for rebuy tourneys?
Personally, I take the most rebuys/addons I expect to make and go from there. For instance, if I was playing the 20R, I could expect (unless something weird happens) to spend no more than $140. Therefore, I see the 20R as a $140 MTT. Someone else may have a better formula for this.
From Fox's article on the subject:
"If the tournament is a rebuy you have to assume at least four times the initial buy-in as a your actual investment. If you play a lot of rebuy tournaments it would be wise to count the number of rebuys and the add-ons for a few tournaments and come up with a good idea what your average investment really is for each tournament."
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| MaestroJay: | |
I'm confused about something
$270 - $6.25 HU
$357 - $5.50 STTs
With HU being higher variance than STTs shouldn't it be the other way around?
Also once the bankroll reaches $357 I can play anything thats listed at the smaller amounts right?
I also need clarification about the cashing out.If you play a $6.25 HU that is 12 cents to add to the cashing out that I understand.So until you reach the sites minimum cashout that 12 cents is gone and you can't play with it at all correct?
HU actually has lower variance than STTs. HU games pay 50% of it's players, while STTs pay 33%, and therefore, the HU structure is flatter.
Yes, at any time, you can play anything listed at any amount smaller. I posted the minimums for each game.
You understand the cashing out thing perfectly.
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i got a question:
jennifear, will you marry me?
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