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I've been approached several times about how to manage a bankroll, and when to cash out. I'm going to address this question very heavily in this post.
The following guidelines will assure with a high confidence level that you never go broke if you are +ROI in the games you are playing, and you exercise good game selection.
Proper Bankroll Management Minimums:
$65 - $1.10 STTs
$90 - $1.10 18-man
$130 - $1.10 45-man, $2.20 STTs
$210 - $5.25 HU
$215 - $3.30 STTs
$270 - $6.25 HU
$357 - $5.50 STTs
$416 - $3.25 45-man
$420 - $10.50 HU
$422 - $6.50 STTs
$440 - $2.20 MTTs, $2.20 180-man
$495 - $3.30 90-man
$585 - $6.50 18-man
$715 - $11 STTs
$780 - $12 STTs
$820 - $21 HU
$832 - $6.50 45-man
$880 - $4.40 MTT, $4.40 180-man
$990 - $11 18-man
$1040 - $16 STTs
$1080 - $12 18-man
$1100 - $5.50 MTTs
$1300 - $6.50 MTTs, $12 27-man, $20 STTs
$1430 - $22 STTs
$1440 - $16 18-man
$1530 - $12 45-man
$1560 - $24 STTs
$1650 - $11 90-man
$1755 - $27 STTs
$1760 - $8.80 MTTs
$1980 - $22 18-man
$2100 - $52.50 HU
$2145 - $33 STTs
$2160 - $24 18-man
$2340 - $36 SNGs
$2400 - $11 MTTs
$2430 - $27 18-man
$2470 - $38 STTs
$2600 - $12 MTTs, $12 180-man
$2970 - $33 18-man
$3300 - $16.50 MTTs
$3320 - $26 45-man
$3420 - $38 18-man
$3450 - $27 45-man
$3570 - $55 STTs
$3900 - $60 STTs, $26 90-man
$4200 - $22 MTTs, $22 180-man
$4250 - $105 HU
$4860 - $38 45-man
$4875 - $75 STTs
$4950 - $55 18-man
$5400 - $60 18-man, $27 MTTs
$6600 - $33 MTTs
$7660 - $60 45-man
$7800 - $39 MTTs
$8250 - $55 90-man
$8500 - $210 HU
$11000 - $55 MTTs
$12000 - $60 MTTs
$15000 - $75 MTTs
$20800 - $109 MTTs
$43000 - $215 MTTs
$106000-$530 MTTs
Clarifications:
- For Double or Nothing SNGs, use the HU guidelines.
- For MTTs with less than 150 players, use the 90-man guidelines.
- If your favorite game is not found on here, simply multiply the buyin by 40 for HU, 50 for FTP's Matrix SNGs, 65 for STTs, 90 for 18-20 man, 108 for 27-man, 128 for 45-man, 150 for 90-man, or 200 for 180-man or MTTs and add it to the list!
- For satellites, to determine how many buyins you need, use the formula (2000/x), where x is the % of the field that gets paid. For example, if a satellite tournament pays 20% of the field, then (2000/20) = 100, so you need 100 buyins.
- I will be crossposting this on my blog here so if you ever want to reference this, that's the easiest place to find it!
- These buyin recommendations are very conservative and are intended to ensure that you make consistant money while your risk of ruin is extremely minimal. It is made for professional players who cannot afford to replenish their bankroll. Recreational players may feel free to cut these recommendations in half.
- Satellites for must-play tournaments should only be played if you have enough in your bankroll for the target tournament, and you have an edge in that target event. There is an exception to this rule, below.
- I didn't include any game with higher than a 10% rake, because I feel that those games are ripoffs.
- If you are feeling good, don't play too far away from your highest allowable game. For instance, if your bankroll allows you to play $22 SNGs and you are playing $11 SNGs, you are not allowing yourself to make enough money.
- If things have been rough lately, or you have lost confidence, there's no need to play at your highest allowable level. Get back that winning feeling by dropping down, and scoring some wins. You'll still be working towards moving up.
Cashout strategy:
Pay yourself according to volume, not results.
Remove the following from your bankroll every time you play these games:
HU: 2% of your buyin
STTs: 3% of your buyin
18-man: 4% of your buyin
45-man: 5% of your buyin
90-man: 6% of your buyin
180-man/MTT: 8% of your buyin
Also remove all Rakeback/Bonuses earned
When your total cashouts reach the site's minimum cashout requirements, then cash out as soon as you can.
Clarifications:
- If you are a high buyin player, you may be playing a SNG where you are only expected to attain a very small ROI. In that case, divide your expected long-term ROI by 2 and cash out that much per game. For instance, if you are a $320 STT player who expects to make 2% ROI, cash out 1% ($3.30) per game played. That sounds small, but most of your income is coming from rakeback/bonuses anyway.
- For hyper/superturbo SNGs, only remove 1.5% per game.
Taking shots (optional):
Then allow yourself 1/4 of your cashout money for entertainment. Your shot can be your entertainment. For instance, if you are a $5 player who would like to take a shot at a $50 game, then save up $200 in cashouts, and then withdraw $150. use the other $50 for your game. Obviously this is not optimal, but some people will explode their bankrolls at some point if they never get a chance to chase their dreams!
Just one rule:
- If you take a shot and win, cash out at least 75% of your winnings RIGHT AWAY. Don't try to use the shot to pad your bankroll. The bankroll management plan is already designed to keep you where you are going to make the most money per hour.
When used together, over time, the Bankroll Management and Cashout Strategy will:
- Keep you playing at or near your optimal level. You won't have to decide what games to play. The system will do it for you.
- Ensure that you are beating the games at a high enough ROI to continue to play them. For instance if you maintain a 3% ROI at the $27 18-mans, although you are winning, you will be cashing out too much money (4%) to stay at that level, and the system will drop you back to the $16 level, where you will make more money per game.
- Keep you from facing high % fluctuations in your bankroll so your mindset is good.
- Have you making frequent cashouts no matter what your results are. This stops the endless cycle that some people have of moving up and moving down, but never cashing out!
- Allow you to plan. Your income will be easily predicatable. For instance, if you are going to play 100 $27 18-mans today, you know you will cash out exactly $108, no matter how you do.
- Encourage you to increase your volume.
- Give you the opportunity to take an occasional shot at a bigger event and chase your dreams.
I really hope this helps someone.
Jen
*edit - Please give your feedback. If you have any suggestions on how I can make this better, please let me know. My goal is to edit this to perfection, and update this to include whatever new popular games may come up.
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bump?
i wanna answer cuz this extensive BR management guide has made me surprisingly aroused (is that weird?)
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 MattieBoy131: | |
Rycky,
Any possibility you could post that spreadsheet you made? I have one of my own, but not sure exactly how to incorporate Jen's post here into it. That would be wicked awesome to have a spreadsheet of this Jennifear gold :)
I would be curious to see this as well. I made a spreadsheet to keep track of my records but it sucks.
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fpdog
(United States)
390
Posts.
Joined
03-06-2006.
12-16-2008 4:28 PM
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In reply to
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Jenn
First off this is an awesome post - perhaps one of the best ever on
p5s. I love the cash out part as I have always wondered how and when to
cash out. I do have a question about cash outs in general that I did
not see on there. I am primarily a satellite player so my payouts are
obviously flatter. However, I play so many types and high
volume I do quite well, and am rolled overall to play the majors with
exception of 100r. I almost always keep the T$ instead of playing the
tourneys, using them for smaller tournys or sngs. My question would be
how do figure out cash out percentages for satellites taking into
account the buyin and flat rate payout? Along with that if I satellite
into a big tourny and decide to play do you recommend using the cash
out formula based on the satellite or the big tourny? Again you rock
and thx.
Dogg
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| fpdog: | |
Jenn
First off this is an awesome post - perhaps one of the best ever on p5s. I love the cash out part as I have always wondered how and when to cash out. I do have a question about cash outs in general that I did not see on there. I am primarily a satellite player so my payouts are obviously flatter. However, I play so many types and high volume I do quite well, and am rolled overall to play the majors with exception of 100r. I almost always keep the T$ instead of playing the tourneys, using them for smaller tournys or sngs. My question would be how do figure out cash out percentages for satellites taking into account the buyin and flat rate payout? Along with that if I satellite into a big tourny and decide to play do you recommend using the cash out formula based on the satellite or the big tourny? Again you rock and thx.
Dogg
Thank you for your kind words :)
Satellites are a funny animal because the % of the field that gets paid is always different. Here's the best quick answer that I can give you that will allow you to work these in:
I would loosely use the "Rule of 2000".
x= the % of the field that is getting paid.
2000/x is the number of buyins you need.
For a satty that pays 20% of the field, you would need 100 buyins. (2000/20)
For a satty that pays 50% of the field, you would need 40 buyins. (2000/50)
For a satty that only pays a few spots, like a $20 satty to a $1000 target tournament, you would need many more buyins to manage the variance appropriately.
As far as cashouts go for these, you would want to cash out appropriately based on the risk:
If the satty pays:
50% of the field, cash out 2%
33% of the field, cash out 3%
20% of the field, cash out 5%
10% of the field, cash out 8%
5% of the field or less, cash out 10%
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Jen, as you know, you are one of my closest on-line friends and I always appreciate your advice (cept for the bashing of my boys!!). But where in this plan does it state what buy-ins of you guess it...roshambo, you can play on a small roll? Assuming someone is up against you, do they even need a bankroll? 
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fpdog
(United States)
390
Posts.
Joined
03-06-2006.
12-16-2008 5:00 PM
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In reply to
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wow you are quick - thx for info - im assuming same structure
regardless off mtt or sng or at best guess the avg payouts to fit into
your formula
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| moman1965: | |
Jen, as you know, you are one of my closest on-line friends and I always appreciate your advice (cept for the bashing of my boys!!). But where in this plan does it state what buy-ins of you guess it...roshambo, you can play on a small roll? Assuming someone is up against you, do they even need a bankroll?
Use HU guidelines for roshambo. Be sure you are playing in heads up games with an ROI of greater than 4% to make this system work for you.
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| fpdog: | |
wow you are quick - thx for info - im assuming same structure regardless off mtt or sng or at best guess the avg payouts to fit into your formula
You got it!
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i didnt look at all the categories, but for sng's atleast, this seems fairly inaccurate. for 75 dollar sngs's your advocating 4875, which is still not enough especially with the tough games these days...sure you also say your ROI needs to be 4% or better to make this system work, but even at 5-6% you'll easily hit a 100 BI downswing over say 25-30,000 sngs...of course this is a big sample that most people will never see, but to use these guidelines as a professional is wrong imo
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| tmac2424: | |
bump?
i wanna answer cuz this extensive BR management guide has made me surprisingly aroused (is that weird?)
sorta....this is awesome jennifear....great great stuff
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Jenn, I have a question regarding satellite shootouts... say its a 10.70 + 1 double shootout that pays top three what should my bank roll be at to play these is the pay % looked at the same way since i have to win a STT first then place in a top % at the next table
thanks!
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awesome post - bad for online poker (=my hourly rate) though 
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| z06fanatic: | |
i didnt look at all the categories, but for sng's atleast, this seems fairly inaccurate. for 75 dollar sngs's your advocating 4875, which is still not enough especially with the tough games these days...sure you also say your ROI needs to be 4% or better to make this system work, but even at 5-6% you'll easily hit a 100 BI downswing over say 25-30,000 sngs...of course this is a big sample that most people will never see, but to use these guidelines as a professional is wrong imo
The 4% ROI + is for HU.
You would be looking at attaining 6% ROI for $75 SNGs to cash out 3%. I mentioned in my OP that with STTs, the system breaks down at the higher buyin SNGs where you can only expect to maintain a small +ROI. That's why I added this in the clarifications:
- If you are a high buyin player, you may be playing a SNG where you are only expected to attain a very small ROI. In that case, divide your expected long-term ROI by 2 and cash out that much per game. For instance, if you are a $320 STT player who expects to make 2% ROI, cash out 1% ($3.30) per game played. That sounds small, but most of your income is coming from rakeback/bonuses anyway.
Even if you experience heavy variance, which, as you noted, you will, the system will work for you. $4875 is the minimum, and if you fall to $4874.99, you'll need to drop. Over time, if you are a big enough winner to make more at $75s than $60s, you'll end up playing the $75s. If not, you'll end up playing the $60s.
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| murondubs: | |
Jenn, I have a question regarding satellite shootouts...
say its a 10.70 + 1 double shootout that pays top three
what should my bank roll be at to play these
is the pay % looked at the same way since i have to win a STT first then place in a top % at the next table
thanks!
Use the rule of 2000 as stated in the OP. By the rules, in a full double shootout satty that pays 10% of the field, you'll need 200 buyins, which is $2340.
(2000/10 = 200)
In my opinion, 150 buyins for these are plenty. $1755.
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jen, say you are a sng and mtt player. for mtts you have the $7800 roll to play $39 mtts does this mean you should also be playing $109 stts?
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