Team play in the $20 Turbo DONs

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Team play in the $20 Turbo DONs

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 11:07 AM

Two players I played with in the $20 DONs are obviously team playing.

Remember when looking at these that DONs play extremely different than SNGs or MTTs. You don't need to accumulate all the chips,you just need to knock out five other players.

1st instance-Hand #28413427533 Suspected Colluder #1 (CharlyJerson) is allin preflop, when Suspected Colluder #2(LaBestiaCulo) makes a "clear out" bet holding 6 high to remove all players from the hand except his teammate who holds 7 high. The move doesn't work anyway, but the effort is what matters. A clueless player or big stack pushing around their weight? Not in this instance. Look at the previous hand (#28413411506) Colluder #2 checks down the hand when another non teammate player is allin so as to keep the third player in the hand and increase chances of a bust out. Totally opposite from the very next play.

It gets worse. I then searched for the two players. Sure enough they were playing together in two other games. I wasn't watching more than two minutes when hand #28413678692 came up. CharlyJerson is allin in the small blind holding 8 high. Big stack LaBestiaCulo makes a clearout bet holding 5 high and CharlyJesron survives.

Detailed hands below:

Standard DON checkdown when someone in allin
PokerStars Game #28413411506: Tournament #165234075, $20.00+$0.80 Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2009/05/20 11:18:51 ET
Table '165234075 1' 10-max Seat #8 is the button
Seat 1: hugosbosse (385 in chips)
Seat 2: LaBestiaCulo (6023 in chips)
Seat 4: CharlyJerson (292 in chips)
Seat 5: Lazzzzzzy (1365 in chips)
Seat 6: cebola (2070 in chips)
Seat 8: NEADY05 (1760 in chips)
Seat 10: Nole91 (3105 in chips)
hugosbosse: posts the ante 25
LaBestiaCulo: posts the ante 25
CharlyJerson: posts the ante 25
Lazzzzzzy: posts the ante 25
cebola: posts the ante 25
NEADY05: posts the ante 25
Nole91: posts the ante 25
Nole91: posts small blind 125
hugosbosse: posts big blind 250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Nole91 [Ac Ks]
LaBestiaCulo: calls 250
CharlyJerson: folds
Lazzzzzzy: folds
cebola: folds
NEADY05: folds
Nole91: calls 125
hugosbosse: raises 110 to 360 and is all-in
LaBestiaCulo: calls 110
Nole91: calls 110
*** FLOP *** [3h 4h Jc]
Nole91: checks
LaBestiaCulo: checks
*** TURN *** [3h 4h Jc] [5c]
Nole91: checks
LaBestiaCulo: checks
*** RIVER *** [3h 4h Jc 5c] [4s]
Nole91: checks
LaBestiaCulo: checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Nole91: shows [Ac Ks] (a pair of Fours)
hugosbosse: mucks hand
LaBestiaCulo: shows [6c 5h] (two pair, Fives and Fours)
LaBestiaCulo collected 1255 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1255 | Rake 0
Board [3h 4h Jc 5c 4s]
Seat 1: hugosbosse (big blind) mucked [Ah 7d]
Seat 2: LaBestiaCulo showed [6c 5h] and won (1255) with two pair, Fives and Fours
Seat 4: CharlyJerson folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Lazzzzzzy folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: cebola folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: NEADY05 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 10: Nole91 (small blind) showed [Ac Ks] and lost with a pair of Fours

No check down very next hand when partner is allin

PokerStars Game #28413427533: Tournament #165234075, $20.00+$0.80 Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2009/05/20 11:19:27 ET
Table '165234075 1' 10-max Seat #10 is the button
Seat 2: LaBestiaCulo (6893 in chips)
Seat 4: CharlyJerson (267 in chips)
Seat 5: Lazzzzzzy (1340 in chips)
Seat 6: cebola (2045 in chips)
Seat 8: NEADY05 (1735 in chips)
Seat 10: Nole91 (2720 in chips)
LaBestiaCulo: posts the ante 25
CharlyJerson: posts the ante 25
Lazzzzzzy: posts the ante 25
cebola: posts the ante 25
NEADY05: posts the ante 25
Nole91: posts the ante 25
LaBestiaCulo: posts small blind 125
CharlyJerson: posts big blind 242 and is all-in
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Nole91 [8s Ah]
Lazzzzzzy: folds
cebola: calls 250
NEADY05: folds
Nole91: calls 250
LaBestiaCulo: raises 500 to 750
cebola: folds
Nole91: folds
Uncalled bet (500) returned to LaBestiaCulo
*** FLOP *** [5d 9c Kc]
*** TURN *** [5d 9c Kc] [4s]
*** RIVER *** [5d 9c Kc 4s] [Ac]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
LaBestiaCulo: shows [5h 6d] (a pair of Fives)
LaBestiaCulo collected 24 from side pot
CharlyJerson: shows [2c 7h] (high card Ace)
LaBestiaCulo collected 1118 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1142 Main pot 1118. Side pot 24. | Rake 0
Board [5d 9c Kc 4s Ac]
Seat 2: LaBestiaCulo (small blind) showed [5h 6d] and won (1142) with a pair of Fives
Seat 4: CharlyJerson (big blind) showed [2c 7h] and lost with high card Ace
Seat 5: Lazzzzzzy folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: cebola folded before Flop
Seat 8: NEADY05 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 10: Nole91 (button) folded before Flop

5 High Big Stack Clearout when partner is Allin in Blinds holding 8 high
PokerStars Game #28413678692: Tournament #165234009, $20.00+$0.80 Hold'em No
Limit - Level X (300/600) - 2009/05/20 11:28:46 ET
Table '165234009 1' 10-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Bastos66 (1389 in chips)
Seat 3: NEADY05 (452 in chips)
Seat 4: Lazzzzzzy (1954 in chips)
Seat 5: CharlyJerson (240 in chips)
Seat 6: Serenity_DK (457 in chips)
Seat 7: totops888 (1596 in chips)
Seat 8: Stegahl (5095 in chips)
Seat 9: LaBestiaCulo (2762 in chips)
Seat 10: Reenberg4 (1055 in chips)
Bastos66: posts the ante 60
NEADY05: posts the ante 60
Lazzzzzzy: posts the ante 60
CharlyJerson: posts the ante 60
Serenity_DK: posts the ante 60
totops888: posts the ante 60
Stegahl: posts the ante 60
LaBestiaCulo: posts the ante 60
Reenberg4: posts the ante 60
Lazzzzzzy: posts small blind 300
CharlyJerson: posts big blind 180 and is all-in
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Serenity_DK: folds
totops888: folds
Stegahl: folds
LaBestiaCulo: raises 900 to 1200
Reenberg4: folds
Bastos66: folds
NEADY05: folds
Lazzzzzzy: folds
Uncalled bet (900) returned to LaBestiaCulo
*** FLOP *** [6h Jd As]
*** TURN *** [6h Jd As] [2s]
*** RIVER *** [6h Jd As 2s] [Tc]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
LaBestiaCulo: shows [5h 3h] (high card Ace)
LaBestiaCulo collected 240 from side pot
CharlyJerson: shows [7c 8d] (high card Ace - Jack+Ten+Eight kicker)
CharlyJerson collected 1080 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1320 Main pot 1080. Side pot 240. | Rake 0
Board [6h Jd As 2s Tc]
Seat 1: Bastos66 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: NEADY05 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Lazzzzzzy (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: CharlyJerson (big blind) showed [7c 8d] and won (1080) with high card
Ace
Seat 6: Serenity_DK folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: totops888 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: Stegahl folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: LaBestiaCulo showed [5h 3h] and won (240) with high card Ace
Seat 10: Reenberg4 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

I sent to support obviously.

Poker Discussion

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008.
05-20-2009 12:10 PM - In reply to

nice find... CharlyJerson & LaBestiaCulo (PokerStars) Filter: SNG Only CharlyJerson LaBestiaCulo Combined Total Played 1033 1806 Played Together 353 353 Av. ROI Apart -3% 6% 1.5% Av. ROI Together 20% 15% 17.5% ugh...obv this won't format well, but if you sharkscope them you can see they've played 353 games together. apart their ROIs are -3% and 6% and together they are 20% and 15%

Echo (United States) 82 Posts. Joined 07-09-2006.
05-20-2009 12:21 PM - In reply to

how the hell have they played 353 games together and not gotten caught already?

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008.
05-20-2009 12:50 PM - In reply to

don't know. there was a DoN prop bet on another forum where a ton of colluding was going on. the players didn't get busted until people in the prop bet thread called stuff to stars attention. this stuff probably goes on a bunch undetected in those.

aad (United States) 2,325 Posts. Joined 02-05-2008.
05-20-2009 1:46 PM - In reply to

Great find! Hope people will get some unexpected $ coming their way!

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008.
05-20-2009 2:41 PM - In reply to

i've played about 4k DoNs and i've never seen 300/600 with 9 players left...that's insane! how high did the blinds end up going in this one? i've seen 500/1000 a couple of times but that's the highest i've been to.

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 2:50 PM - In reply to

It actually ended pretty quickly after that- maybe an orbit or two.

Funny thing was that the final bustout was LaBestiaCulo raising 8 high to clear out for CharlyJerson microstacked and allin as the big blind. He had AK, but 8 river did him in. I didn't include that hand here or in my email to Stars since the table closed before I could grab the hand#.

RGC2005 (United States) 309 Posts. Joined 07-06-2008.
05-20-2009 3:54 PM - In reply to

Let us know what stars says when they get back to you.

I got a mysterious credit of $67.77 on my account today which feels like SNG play. Maybe they are figuring out the DON and SNG collusion angle shooters have dropped down in limits.

j_farah (Canada) 2,161 Posts. Joined 07-13-2006.
05-20-2009 4:04 PM - In reply to

Def collusion.

Don't worry though, Stars support will set things right.

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 5:05 PM - In reply to

j_farah:
Def collusion.
Don't worry though, Stars support will set things right.

Didn't really affect me- ended up winning anyway.

Sent to support because the DONs are ripe for things like this. My only concern is that the poker "specialists" they assign to investigate don't always understand the dynamics of DON play. A DON regular can spot these things a mile away; to someone who plays SNGs and MTTs (where the big stacks will accumulate chips with a wide variety of hands) they are not always as evident as this.

I sent a similiar one in several months ago and received back an email from the "specialist" with a breakdown of the play that would be fine in a SNG, but just didn't apply to the DON situations I documented. They put a note in the player's files and took no other action. With the number of tourneys that these 2 have played together, hopefully the outcome will be different.

kornkid (United States) 767 Posts. Joined 04-12-2005.
05-20-2009 7:46 PM - In reply to

nice catch

hard to believe people are dumb enough to try that shit

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 7:56 PM - In reply to

kornkid:
nice catch

hard to believe people are dumb enough to try that shit

fck me- just played another one with them. Multitabling and they registered after I did. I decided not to tip them off since it will take Stars a while to investigate. This one was even worse in terms of obvious collsion since they were seated next to each other.

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 8:00 PM - In reply to

Blatant chip dump in most recent DON

PokerStars Game #28431791722: Tournament #165363030, $20.00+$0.80 Hold'em No
Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2009/05/20 20:14:34 ET
Table '165363030 1' 10-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: forgettt (3895 in chips)
Seat 2: debruys (1220 in chips)
Seat 3: Nole91 (1690 in chips)
Seat 4: Tom_The_Bird (2115 in chips)
Seat 5: mystaby (1010 in chips)
Seat 6: Ikadi (1215 in chips)
Seat 8: LaBestiaCulo (1925 in chips)
Seat 9: CharlyJerson (735 in chips)
Seat 10: tipiak01 (1195 in chips)
forgettt: posts the ante 15
debruys: posts the ante 15
Nole91: posts the ante 15
Tom_The_Bird: posts the ante 15
mystaby: posts the ante 15
Ikadi: posts the ante 15
LaBestiaCulo: posts the ante 15
CharlyJerson: posts the ante 15
tipiak01: posts the ante 15
LaBestiaCulo: posts small blind 75
CharlyJerson: posts big blind 150
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Nole91 [Ac 3s]
tipiak01: folds
forgettt: folds
debruys: folds
Nole91: folds
Tom_The_Bird: folds
mystaby: folds
Ikadi: folds
LaBestiaCulo: calls 75
CharlyJerson: checks
*** FLOP *** [Qc 7d Jd]
LaBestiaCulo: bets 150
CharlyJerson: raises 420 to 570 and is all-in
LaBestiaCulo: folds
Uncalled bet (420) returned to CharlyJerson
CharlyJerson collected 735 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 735 | Rake 0
Board [Qc 7d Jd]
Seat 1: forgettt folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: debruys folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Nole91 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Tom_The_Bird folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: mystaby folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Ikadi (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: LaBestiaCulo (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 9: CharlyJerson (big blind) collected (735)
Seat 10: tipiak01 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

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Team play in the $20 Turbo DONs Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006. 05-20-2009 11:07 AM

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008. 05-20-2009 12:10 PM - In reply to

Echo (United States) 82 Posts. Joined 07-09-2006. 05-20-2009 12:21 PM - In reply to

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008. 05-20-2009 12:50 PM - In reply to

aad (United States) 2,325 Posts. Joined 02-05-2008. 05-20-2009 1:46 PM - In reply to

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008. 05-20-2009 2:41 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006. 05-20-2009 2:50 PM - In reply to

RGC2005 (United States) 309 Posts. Joined 07-06-2008. 05-20-2009 3:54 PM - In reply to

j_farah (Canada) 2,161 Posts. Joined 07-13-2006. 05-20-2009 4:04 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006. 05-20-2009 5:05 PM - In reply to

kornkid (United States) 767 Posts. Joined 04-12-2005. 05-20-2009 7:46 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006. 05-20-2009 7:56 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006. 05-20-2009 8:00 PM - In reply to

Team play in the $20 Turbo DONs

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 11:07 AM

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008.
05-20-2009 12:10 PM - In reply to

Echo (United States) 82 Posts. Joined 07-09-2006.
05-20-2009 12:21 PM - In reply to

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008.
05-20-2009 12:50 PM - In reply to

aad (United States) 2,325 Posts. Joined 02-05-2008.
05-20-2009 1:46 PM - In reply to

zercher 5 Posts. Joined 04-10-2008.
05-20-2009 2:41 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 2:50 PM - In reply to

RGC2005 (United States) 309 Posts. Joined 07-06-2008.
05-20-2009 3:54 PM - In reply to

j_farah (Canada) 2,161 Posts. Joined 07-13-2006.
05-20-2009 4:04 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 5:05 PM - In reply to

kornkid (United States) 767 Posts. Joined 04-12-2005.
05-20-2009 7:46 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 7:56 PM - In reply to

Nole91 (United States) 800 Posts. Joined 02-28-2006.
05-20-2009 8:00 PM - In reply to