1. Joined this forum a few months ago. Am much more a live player, having good results over the last few years. After joining this forum I noticed how much was to be made playing via Pokerstars and the huge amount of tournys they run. So over the last couple of months I deposited about $400 online to start playing low limit tourneys ($11 15k guarenteed, $6 sng's, and $5 rebuy sats for EPT's). Anyways, needless to say it has not gone too well. I have grinded the tournys, putting in many hours but not receiving much in terms of reward. Playing at this level online makes pretty much any game I play a minefield of bad players, bad beats and bad decisions (often because I am unable to know how much credit to give my oppenents). How do people increase their bankroll at this level before moving up? Live, i play $50 to $200 freezeouts, with about 75-100 players. They know when to fold, when to make a move and the assumed amount of credit to give you oppenent at this level of buy in comes almost as standard. I figure that this level of play only exists online in the 109r, 1050 super tuesday etc. Because as I have seen in the Sunday Mil, Nightly Hundred etc there are so many sat qualifiers that you need 8 hrs of miracle play to cash big. Unfortunately because of my online experience I do not feel comfortable depositing a bigger amount to play these higher level tournys, as I do normally wen I play live, because of the pitfalls. Anyways, just wana ask others if they have or do experience the same issues; how they overcame them; and whether they do think its worth sticking it out? Cheers.
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  2. Paragraphs Pleeze
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  3. The play is drastically different, lower buyin's your gonna have to NOT BLUFF NOT MAKE MOVES and get enough cards to get your chips when your opponent has K2 and you have AK with the flop K X X. This is how i traffic my way through these tournies. best of luck
     
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  4. If you're that good you should be destroying these fields! Maybe your $200 freezeouts were much smaller fields. 600+ fields are gonna show exceptionally wide varience. $400 roll is ridiculous, try $4000 to play these tournies. Oh, and for the record, although the overall standard is lower than higher limits, there are still some very good players playing low buyins.
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  5. The age old sob story. I can't beat bad online players, but the good live players i can beat.

    Ever consider that you may have this backwards?

    This is a numbers game, volume volume volume. Making the correct decisions in the long run will pay.
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  6. Spot on Monkey.. WP sir
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  7. I think Hellion and Monkey have the best advice for you. Varience it going to be very high in these large field low buy-in tournies so it may take a long time to truly reap the rewards even if you are playing well. As for the players perhaps you aren't giving players enough credit, I know there are a lot of donks but also many solid players in these fields. Perhaps you are assuming the players are donks before you actually see them getting out of line and you end up playing into a more solid player. I did this a little as well but I've learned to wait a rotation or two, after that it should be clear how certain players are playing.

    GL at the tables.
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  8. Grind. Grind. Oh, and grind some more. A diet consisting of strcitly MTT's at this level is going to leave you hungry. The varience is pretty big. IMHO varience goes up exponetially as the dollar amount goes down. This is due to the increased number of people and wilder play.

    At the level you are at, I'd spend 80% of your time doing SNG's increasing your BR. IMHO the varience for a low level SNG isn't what it is for an MTT. You should be able to own SNG's from $1 - $20 if you are a good as you say you are. If not, then focus on $5 or $10 SNG's ( given you have a $400 BR ) and reinvest a % of your week's or day's earnings into BR and use the other % for MTT's.

    I like doing it on a weekly basis since you can have some swings from day to day. Say you are going to grind for a week doing SNG's then take 50% of your winnings and use them towards MTT's in the following week. Even though you will be playing some MTT's that week, continue to grind SNG's again taking out 50% of your winnings for MTT's in the upcoming week.

    FYI, I do know what you mean though. Getting through a $5 or $10 MTT can be brutal. There is an ass load of players and even getting it in good you will have to avoid a lot of suckouts. I think the larger buy in tourneys have a little less varience due to the smaller fields but of course the players at that level are a lot tougher. With a $400 BR though you only have a few shots at the larger buy-ins. Stick with grinding your way up and you'll benefit in many ways. You'll gain experience with all types of players as well as BR management. BR managment is the toughest thing to master. You will get some scores here and there but it is what you do with your BR in between those times that matters. You talk about how to get past the donks and low limits, BR management is the answer.
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  9. thanks, good advice. i have been playin a lot of low limit sngs to build my roll and then i mostly parlay that into tourneys. its the tourneys that are doin my money tho. i just need a couple of decent cashes so i can stop grindin the low limit sngs for profit. but alas they have avoided me so far...
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  10. oppenent is spelt Opponent. Oh yeah online is diffrent from live poker but your going to play alot more passive donks like youself live. I hate MTTs anyways shit for bankroll grinding :) Try the 6.50s on FTP or 5/18s 45s 90s on their as well soft fields and you could easily smash them with a $400 br.
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  11. What's better for grinding out a $200 bankroll 9 mans or 18-45s?
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  12. Caleb, I love it when people want to just complain about not having paragraphs, but then can't spell please right :). If your going to be the grammar police, at least do it full-ass, not half ass (meant to be read in a joking manner here).

    For the OP, have you thought that the problem could be you? I like to use the example of a baseball pitcher. If you pitch at the major leagues, you can't just throw heat. Sure, Justin Verlander (Tiger pitcher) can throw 100 mph, but he'll get killed at the top levels if he just throws heat. So, you mix in changeups, cureballs, etc.

    But, now say he's going to pitch to high schoolers. If he mixes in change-ups, he might get crushed when players too slow to catch up to the heat guess wrong and catch up to it. So, if he's playing against lesser competition, he'd just throw heat, and be done.

    Now, back to poker. Ok, your bad players will chase down everything with Ax, and won't fold. What should you do. Get something better than Ax and then bet them straight down taking all their money. Not only that, but if you have JJ (or even KK), make a good bet, and then they call, and an ace spikes, realize that, no matter how strong your bet is, they won't fold, so it might be worth folding, even if some of the time it's wrong).

    Also, don't tell fanciful stories to set up a bluff (or betting every street with nothing). Just play simpler ABC poker, use things like position and ICM to give you an advantage.

    Now, sure, it's a minefield. If you play with a thousand players, you won't win every single time. But, given enough time, you will. So, try and find some smaller events (like the 90-180 man SNG's) or just ride the variance out.

    Also, think of the absurdity of your statement. What other skill game can you play where people actually think they can crush very good players, but players who do stupid things are unbeatable? What would you rather beat, 30 bad players (at anything) or 30 good ones? Give me the 30 bad ones anyday (and the $5 games are what I play regularly).
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  13. If you truly can beat 60-100 field players at 75-100 buyins live, you should have no problem beating the low limit online tourneys but the distance between cashes will be longer b/c of field size. Skip the tourneys that payout 20% of the field b/c it requires a longer stretch of survival and maintaining a good stack between the two times when its easiest to chip up (the bubble and the final table bubble)

    If you truly can beat those bigger buyin tourneys live and want to play higher online poker is perfectly legit and safe for a large deposit. I seriously doubt this is the case though.

    If you want to play smaller field tourneys in the 10 range play on Ub. My husband plays there all the time and he FTs about once a week.

    People will flame me for the last one but he uses epassporte and hasnt had any problems out of UB paying out or depositing.
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  14. If you truly can beat 60-100 field players at 75-100 buyins live, you should have no problem beating the low limit online tourneys but the distance between cashes will be longer b/c of field size. Skip the tourneys that payout 20% of the field b/c it requires a longer stretch of survival and maintaining a good stack between the two times when its easiest to chip up (the bubble and the final table bubble)

    If you truly can beat those bigger buyin tourneys live and want to play higher online poker is perfectly legit and safe for a large deposit. I seriously doubt this is the case though.

    If you want to play smaller field tourneys in the 10 range play on Ub. My husband plays there all the time and he FTs about once a week.

    People will flame me for the last one but he uses epassporte and hasnt had any problems out of UB paying out or depositing.
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  15. first off lol at live 100-150 Fos being anywhere near the quality of the super tuesday and 109Rs...thats a joke I can guarantee you that live players are much worse than online players...

    2ndly play 4.40 180 mans...they have terrible people be patient at first then open a large amount of pots later and you should be fine
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  16. with $400, you have <40 buyins at $11,
    40 buyins is not enough at any level when you are playing in fields regularly over 1000-1500
    The average player will make a final table (where the real money is) 1 in 100-150 times in that field, so even the best players can go 40 buyins without hitting a FT......

    Some people can cope with that, but for you it seems playing 40 games and not hitting a FT is a bit discouraging.
    IMO you need to play smaller fields (around 200 runners) on that BR and if you can beat the level volume is the key and you'll get a few nice cashes
     
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  17. exactly, if your complaining about the number of bad players in your game, you've got the idea all wrong.
     
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  18. I was not in anyway comparing the live freezeouts I play to the Super Tuesday or 109r. My point was that these are the only online tourneys that seem to filter out alot of the donks and pitfalls found in the majority of online play. I also appreciate that this is an online forum, and I have alot of respect for all poker players online or not, but mate i assure you that the phrase "live players are much worse than online players" is extremely ignorant.
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