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Negative Feedback - Smoothuster (LuckyLeo80 on Lock)

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I really never wanted to create one of these threads, but it is absolutely necessary at this point.

Recently, I opened up applications for backing on Lock Poker because I wanted to find highly motivated, high-volume horses. Leonard August aka smoothustler applied and based on his results and volume I decided to sign him up. After just a few days I decided based on his attitude and liberal use of my money without permission that the deal wasn't going to work. I'd go into specifics but I want to get this out as quickly as possible.

He was basically breakeven with the money in his account (~2k). I made it EXTREMELY clear that I wanted him to send the funds back as soon as possible and that the deal was off. I signed onto Lock only to find him playing a full schedule today. He is not signed onto Skype and is clearly in full out scam mode.

I understand this is partly my fault for not being more diligent in the screening process, but I obviously was correct on my judge of his character over only just 3 short days. It's really disappointing that someone will risk ruining all their credibility over something like this, but it was his choice and now he needs to face the consequences.

I will keep the situation updated as it progresses.

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  • #1

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wackyJaxon    0

Chances are he scammed you, but we will give him a day or two to respond here before banning him from the site for on site scamming activity and give him an undertitle as well.

As a word of advise to you. Whenever I am considering backing someone I do not know, I always google search them to see their prior activity. If they do not show anything positive or negative there, then I ask the person for references. If those references are not people that I know or people that I know that stake others, then I pass as there will always be other players looking for backing.

For smoothhustler, a quick google search shows he has Do Not Stake on PTP which is usually a sign of someone to avoid. http://forum.parttimepoker.com/members/smoothustler.html

GL with this situation, and hopefully you are not out a lot of money. Please try to be more diligent for your own sake going forward. You can still get screwed over even being diligent, but this one could have been avoided before sending money. Hopefully this is a misunderstanding and you get the money back you are due along with an apology.

 
  • #2

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Wacky, I saw this, but if you look deeper into the situation it was for $1.11 over 3 years ago. No history of serious scamming, and obviously a well-established player on the network. Just unfortunate overall.

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wackyJaxon    0

If someone is going to take 3 years before paying back a small amount not caring about the fact they were rolling, I think they are a big risk since if there is any big amount involved they probably do not have very much integrity to pay on a big score or just to take funds entirely. I don't think everyone that has rolled or had problems on other sites are bad people as circumstances sometimes happen that weren't typical, but it does add a risk that I don't want to add on top of the typical risks in backing someone.

As mentioned, I hope it works out for you, and hope it doesn't take 3 years for him to try to resolve with you if he tries at all.

 
  • #4

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Ahurazor    0

Sigh, i wonder if theres a way p5s could implement something that backers can leave feedback/references if u will in a seperate part of ones profile. I suppose it would be to easy to abuse. meh feels like something could be done to aid decisions somehow though, the question is what.

There is just to much of this going on.

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Mahon78    10

at least you found out early and only lost 2k. but why to people act like they are totally shocked and disgusted when they get scammed by a poker player? poker has some of the biggest scum bags youll find out there. look at this year alone. You dont go to a michael barrymore house party without at least 1 person trying to f**k you.

stop staking players if you dont like anal is my point. gl getting the money back though

  • #8

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ILoseRaces    0

There is just to much of this going on.

meet 'generation me'

at least you found out early and only lost 2k. but why to people act like they are totally shocked and disgusted when they get scammed by a poker player?

shocked? no. disgusted? rightfully so

Edited by ILoseRaces
  • #9

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Ahurazor    0

meet 'generation me'

shocked? no. disgusted? rightfully so

Yep its a definite sigh, I mean obviously im not surprised, But I still think there has to be a way we can decrease it a little bit with some kind of system.

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Mahon78    10

Yep its a definite sigh, I mean obviously im not surprised, But I still think there has to be a way we can decrease it a little bit with some kind of system.

I have the perfect system, stop giving them money.

  • #11

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Ahurazor    0

I have the perfect system, stop giving them money.

I dont think u realise how successful and smoothly most backing operations run. It is a few that give it a bad name, So being a little more open minded would probably be a decent thing, and focus on the few who are spoiling it and how we could limit it even further.

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  • #12

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tyson219    0

I have the perfect system, stop giving them money.

To be honest, we don't really care about your system. This is a discussion about this situation and not backing overall.

I've had trouble with a 1 out of 10-12 horses, and even then the situation was resolved and I didn't lose any money. It's a rare situation. Generally backing situations are mutually beneficial. Unfortunately, even if you're diligent, some people still cause issues and this is the end result. When this happens, the best way to resolve the problem by posting it in a public forum. Even if the horse dones't replay, at least future backers have a warning.

Good luck Doug getting this fixed. Hope it turns out for the best. If not, I'll slowroll Leo for you.

  • #13

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Thanks everyone for the input. I understand this is a risk that goes along with backing, but I have done this for a while with many different people and never had an issue like this. I find that when you're respectful to the person and show you trust them it takes a true lack of character to screw someone over.

At this point, I am just hoping to get my money back. He should take into account how badly this is going to tarnish his image and make receiving any sort of backing in the future very difficult. I made a decision and asked him to respect it and he chose not to. He is now seemingly freerolling my money (and had a pretty profitable day today) and ignoring any attempted contact. If anyone has a direct mode of contact with him I kindly ask that you bring up the situation with him and try to talk some sense into him.

Scamming someone is a temporary fix that will cause irreversible damage to your reputation. I can only hope he realizes that.

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  • #17

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CBorders    0

at least you found out early and only lost 2k. but why to people act like they are totally shocked and disgusted when they get scammed by a poker player? poker has some of the biggest scum bags youll find out there. look at this year alone. You dont go to a michael barrymore house party without at least 1 person trying to f**k you.

stop staking players if you dont like anal is my point. gl getting the money back though

FGbiggal.gif

  • #19

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Here is my final update on the situation. I was repaid my 2k, but would like to lay out the whole story through my eyes.

Last night I dropped Leo at around 4 AM. He was clearly very upset and asked for another chance. I told him my decision was final and that I'd like him to send back the 2k in staking money. He told me that his accounts were restricted and that he would send the money back when this restriction was lifted. He signed off Skype that night and I assumed that he would make good on this promise.

Early today, Leo was not signed onto Skype and I checked for him on Lock. He was online but nothing was listed in his games. I decided to check some lobbies for other horses and saw that Luckyleo80 was in fact playing and that he had blocked the ability for me to search him directly (It was not this way the day before). Skype was our only established mode of communication at this point and there was no effort to explain what was going on. At this point I decided to post the thread since it was clearly a concern that he was freerolling my money.

Throughout the day he made final tables and had a fairly profitable day (profit of around 2k). At around 1:45 AM he signed onto Skype and we began talking for the first time since I chose to drop him. He then informed me that the whole day he was never using my funds and that he cashed in his VIP points and ran up enough in cash games to start an MTT session.

I have no way of verifying this one way or the other. Leo is free to post in this thread and provide proof that this was in fact the case. I went off the information I had and thought this thread was the best course of action. Regardless, I am glad that the funds that were rightfully mine were returned to me. This will be my last post in this thread unless other facts need to be presented.

Edited by OU_dlanger610
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  • #20

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What a scummer... I will make sure to get into high variance spots against him in the future.

Glad u got ur 2k back Doug, but u were prob entitled to an additional 1k or w/e your terms for the backing deal were. Hate to see all these regs scamming and doing shady stuff lately. People have no integrity, it makes me sick.

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  • #21

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katz4551    0

All you have to do is ask him to do an audit and show you on teamviewer where he cashed in his points. This way you can see if he actually had enough points to play the session he did. Also check ptr and see if he played cash.

Just checked PTR and he actually lost money yesterday.

HandsStakesNetStartEndtoggle-on.png 71

replay_session.png

$1/$2 FLH (6-max) $0.20Jan 6th - 11:25pm CSTJan 6th - 11:46pm CST toggle-on.png 33

replay_session.png

$5/$10 FLH (6-max) $-75.12Jan 6th - 8:40pm CSTJan 6th - 8:56pm CST toggle-on.png 6

replay_session.png

$1/$2 FLH (6-max) $16.53Jan 6th - 6:00pm CSTJan 6th - 6:06pm CST

  • #23

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wackyJaxon    0

well you did give him almost 24 hrs before outing him in the forum

Why would he, he shut him off and was freerolling him on his money. The fact that he got paid back just makes it a little less scummy imo. He was basically staking him for a period of time while getting 0% of the profit and all of the risk. I doubt the OP would have gotten any of his money back if the person he was risking money with didn't get 2nd in the $20r. OP did the right thing to both warn the community not to give this guy any money in both the immediate term and long-term, and waiting 24 hours would have just been wrong since the guy was there playing on his funds and cut off all contact.

Edited by wackyJaxon
 
  • #25

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gjallen1975    0

Why would he, he shut him off and was freerolling him on his money. The fact that he got paid back just makes it a little less scummy imo. He was basically staking him for a period of time while getting 0% of the profit and all of the risk. I doubt the OP would have gotten any of his money back if the person he was risking money with didn't get 2nd in the $20r. OP did the right thing to both warn the community not to give this guy any money in both the immediate term and long-term, and waiting 24 hours would have just been wrong since the guy was there playing on his funds and cut off all contact.

i don't know what happened, and neither do you. i can't transfer money from my Merge accounts right now, because i haven't completed the verification. i guess what i'm saying is this: OP drops horse, asks for money back. Horse says account is restricted and he will send money back when restriction is lifted. Horse sends money less than 24 hours later. What did horse do wrong? What did he do to get outted on thread? It's easy for you (see bold) to speculate that horse wasn't using money he got for cashing in his FPPs, but how do you know?

EDIT: I just read katz's remarks, and that changes things. something concrete and factual.

Edited by gjallen1975
  • #26

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i don't know what happened, and neither do you. i can't transfer money from my Merge accounts right now, because i haven't completed the verification. i guess what i'm saying is this: OP drops horse, asks for money back. Horse says account is restricted and he will send money back when restriction is lifted. Horse sends money less than 24 hours later. What did horse do wrong? What did he do to get outted on thread? It's easy for you (see bold) to speculate that horse wasn't using money he got for cashing in his FPPs, but how do you know?

lol, do u realize how many points he would need to play that schedule?

So you can transfer in without verification, but not transfer out?

yes

  • #28

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tyson219    0

So you can transfer in without verification, but not transfer out?

I believe that's the case. It's a moot point here though so I know for a fact that Leo was backed by someone other than Doug in the past. He definitely has transfer abilities. Merge does require you to wait 4 days before transferring, so it possilbe that leo couldn't transfer out at the time. Regardless, he shouldn't have been playing without first clearing it with Doug, even if he was using VIP points/cash game profits (which i highly doubt is true).

  • #29

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gjallen1975    0

well i don't know what scedule he was playing, so no, i'm not sure how many points that would take.

look, based on katz's keen investigative remarks, it sounds to me like horse was freerolling on backers money. so ban him or whatev.

that doesn't change the fact that OP initially left out that horse agreed when dropped to send money back when transfer restriction was lifted. and yes, i can see how OP was worried when he logged in to find him playing a full schedule, and was blocked on skype/merge by horse.

but, without katz's evidence, i don't know that OP didn't deposit his own money that day because he just felt like playing, backed or not. i don't know that he didn't cash in his points. even if he was freerolling on OP's money, if there was a restriction, and he xferred the backers money back as soon as the restriction was lifted, then it's a non-issue.

in OP's defense, thread title says negative feedback, not ripped off/scammed, and the negative feedback certainly seems justified.

Edited by gjallen1975
  • #30

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